Covid-19: Devolved Administrations

Private Notice Question

Asked by

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what further steps they are taking to ensure a common approach between the UK Government and devolved administrations for COVID-19 related matters.

My Lords, I wish to ask a Question of which I have given private notice, on what steps, further to the joint Statement on UK-wide Christmas arrangements by the UK Government and devolved Administrations on Tuesday 24 November, Her Majesty’s Government will take to ensure a common approach to other Covid-19-related matters.

My Lords, the UK Government are committed to working with the devolved Administrations to protect the health of our citizens, communities and economies. We published a Statement on 25 September setting out this shared commitment, and our UK-wide approach to arrangements at Christmas is an example of it working in action. We will continue our substantive ministerial, official and scientific engagement to protect the lives and livelihoods of citizens across Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and England.

My Lords, I am pleased at what, at last, has been achieved by the four Governments. As the drafter of the first Welsh devolution Bills, I would always fight for the right of devolved Governments to take their own decisions on devolved matters, but I never contemplated that there would be so many differences on decisions around infections which know no boundaries. Has the apparent stubbornness been in Whitehall, Cardiff, Edinburgh or Belfast?

My Lords, I cast stones at nobody. I agree with the noble and learned Lord that co-operation is always the best route forward and posturing is never helpful. The Christmas alignment arose from a joint meeting at very high level on 2 September, which was followed up by four further high-level conversations. It is an example of co-operation in action.

My Lords, speaking as a Scot, Christmas is a secondary festival to new year for many of us. What steps have been taken to address issues of cross-border policing for the whole of the festive period?

My Lords, as the noble Baroness knows, I am not a line Minister on this specific question, but I will ensure that she is advised on the matter.

The next speaker is the noble and learned Lord, Lord Mackay of Clashfern. He is not answering, so I call the noble and gallant Lord, Lord Craig of Radley. There is a problem with the sound, so we will come back to the noble and gallant Lord. I call the noble Lord, Lord Reid of Cardowan.

My Lords, like many in this Chamber, I very much welcome the UK-wide discussions to help us combat Covid. It is always better when we are helping each other. In that context, how much, as a total, have the UK Government distributed in consequentials and Covid-related expenditure to Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland?

My Lords, the noble Lord asks a very important question. I fear I cannot answer with a specific figure, but I will write to the noble Lord and advise others on that matter. As he says, the UK Government have procured vaccines for the whole of the United Kingdom. The Joint Biosecurity Centre, part of NHS Test and Trace, is UK-wide, and the UK Government provide testing capacity to all the devolved Administrations, including operating testing sites across the United Kingdom. Mutual aid and co-operation across and between all four nations has, in our judgment, been a key part in ensuring that PPE gets to where it is needed. I will write on the figures.

I call the noble and gallant Lord, Lord Craig of Radley. There are still problems. I call the noble Lord, Lord McNally.

My Lords, I am sure the Minister would agree that optics are important in fighting a campaign. One problem that we face in fighting the Covid epidemic is that quite often the Prime Minister has seemed to be uttering appeals from the imperial Parliament. Should not he take advice from, or the example of, his hero Churchill, who in 1940 brought in the Opposition and presented a national front? Should not a special COBRA meeting be set up and meet regularly, involving opposition leaders and the leaders of the four nations? That would send a message of national unity that is missing at the moment.

My Lords, again, I do not agree with taking this to my right honourable friend the Prime Minister who leads in taking decisions and is involved in conversations. I think it is more important to stress the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Reid, that there is active, high-level engagement across the Governments and that is securing progress. We believe in devolution, and the devolved Administrations have public health responsibilities. I repeat that co-operation exists and should continue to exist.

I call the noble and gallant Lord, Lord Craig of Radley. The problems continue. I call the noble Lord, Lord Jopling.

My Lords, I want to add to the contribution of the noble Baroness, Lady Barker, about the position of Scotland and the jubilation which surrounds the new year. In the north of England we have over the years been accustomed to a massive migration of Scots going back to Scotland for new year and then coming back to England or elsewhere afterwards. It is essential that the rules that apply to Christmas also apply to the new year so that the Scots can fully enjoy their traditional holiday. Therefore, it is crucial that there is the utmost co-operation between the devolved Administrations, particularly with Scotland, so that jubilation does not increase the level of Covid outbreaks.