I beg to move, That the Bill be read a Second time.
As chairman of the all-party parliamentary group on zoos and aquariums, a former shadow Minister for animal welfare and a committed advocate for the care and protection of animals, I am proud to be given the opportunity to sponsor this Bill. I want to thank all MPs who have co-sponsored my Bill, but there is one MP I want to thank in particular, and that is the greatest advocate for animal welfare I believe this House has ever seen—the man who should have been with Vivienne yesterday as she strutted her stuff around Victoria Gardens and was crowned winner of the 2021 Westminster dog of the year contest, my friend and our dearly missed colleague, Sir David Amess. Had he not been taken from us, he would most certainly have been here today supporting the Bill that I now lay before the House.
As a nation of animal lovers, we must not tolerate those who present a threat to the health and welfare of animals in England, or of course across our United Kingdom. We are proud of our world-leading standards and we continually strive to improve and maintain our position as world leaders in animal welfare. We already have effective, detailed and powerful laws to maintain the health and welfare of our animals, the quality of our animal products and the biosecurity of our nation. However, we lack a system of penalties to redirect behaviour when those with animals in their care are not doing things quite right. We are lacking an option that can sit between warning letters and criminal prosecution. I believe that penalty notices can be the next step in establishing the UK as a world leader in animal health and welfare.
For the most severe crimes, criminal prosecution will always be the most appropriate course of action. We all see the immense value of the Animal Welfare (Sentencing) Act 2021, which my hon. Friend the Member for West Dorset (Chris Loder) so finely championed, in introducing longer prison sentences for heinous animal welfare crimes. I know that every Member in the House would acknowledge that there is a difference between mistakenly logging a farm animal’s movements incorrectly and cruelly, intentionally abusing an animal.
Some offences can occur without the presence of ill will or due to a genuine mistake; for example, transgressions relating to the recording of livestock movements. We have a fantastic farming community in this country, who work extremely hard, around the clock, to properly look after their animals, and they understand the importance of knowing where livestock are and where they have come from.
In 2019, there were 45,000 cattle keepers and 61,000 sheep farmers in England. It is critical that movements are recorded in line with our laws to protect public health, animal welfare and the national herds and flocks. The risk is that, if livestock movements are not recorded accurately, it limits our ability to control and address animal disease. Most farmers record their livestock’s movements accurately and they respond well to advice and guidance from our enforcement authorities.
I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Romford (Andrew Rosindell) for introducing the Bill. We are a proud nation of animal lovers, and that includes me: my beautiful dog Poppy, a cairn terrier, is often to be seen by my side as I walk around Broxtowe.
The Bill is crucial in ensuring that we stand up for the rights of animals, and that those who do not respect those rights are held to account. It will also ensure that there is no longer a gap in legislation surrounding the prosecution of animal rights offenders, and it contains the necessary legal protections to ensure that it is not misused and is enacted only for the most serious of offences. I therefore agree with my hon. Friend that it will improve the way in which we tackle animal health and welfare offences in the future.
1:03 pm
Ruth Edwards (Rushcliffe) (Con)
I think it is customary to start by congratulating the Bill’s promoter, but I hope that my hon. Friend the Member for Romford (Andrew Rosindell) will bear with me for one moment while I join him in congratulating Vivienne on her victory in yesterday’s Westminster Dog of the Year contest. I am sure that Sir David Amess would have been extremely proud of her.
My hon. Friend was, of course, right to say that Sir David was one of the leading advocates for animal welfare—but so, of course, is my hon. Friend. I congratulate him hugely on bringing the Bill to the House. I know he has been working on the issue for many years. Thirteen years ago, when we were still in opposition, I was the researcher on the shadow Home Affairs team for my hon. Friend the Member for Reigate (Crispin Blunt). My hon. Friend the Member for Romford had the shadow animal welfare brief and I remember his work on dogs. The other day I was particularly recalling his work on tortoise microchipping because I was pursuing our tortoise Geoffrey across the garden. It is very unfair that tortoises have this reputation for moving slowly, because they do not; they move at incredible speed, especially Geoffrey. He has this determination to try to eat pebbles the size of his head, which would be incredibly bad for him, so we have to keep an eye on him. Probably a GPS tracker might have been better than a microchip. My husband has suggested a strobe. Any other suggestions are most welcome.
Geoffrey is not the only adventurous animal in our care. We have two donkeys: Sergeant Wilson and Godfrey. [Hon. Members: “Hear, hear!”] Thank you. The other week, I had to extract them from the chicken run. We have two entrances to the chicken run: the little entrance is for the chicken and the big door for the humans. They had managed to open the big door and walk into the run because they wanted to raid the chicken feed. I arrived to find two donkeys guiltily munching in there.
The prize for the best animal adventure has to go to our pig, Andrew. This was when my husband and I lived on his small holding in Wales and Andrew staged a break-out from the new pig pen we had built. Andrew is jet black and he wandered into the maintenance cupboard, trod in a tin of white paint and gave himself a beautiful white sock on one leg. He then trod on the back of a tube of silicone sealant and gave himself a beautiful Santa Claus beard to match his white sock. He then decided to do his bit for the environment. He managed to encounter a bag of recycling, but he did not quite get the hang of it because he proceeded to redistribute that round the farmyard. Then he managed to break into the boot room and get himself shut in the downstairs loo.
1:08 pm
Sara Britcliffe (Hyndburn) (Con)
I rise to wholeheartedly welcome the Bill and to pay my tributes to Sir David Amess, who was a great champion. I am so glad that Vivienne did win yesterday.
Pets are more than just pets. At home, they are companions. I see that in my own family. Now that all the children have moved out of the family home, my dad is stuck with three cats: Noodle, who is 21 years old, Poppy and Macy. We witnessed an attack on Noodle when he was a kitten. He came back to the house after someone, we believe, shot him with a BB Gun, making him lose all movement in his leg, which he now uses as a crutch. We were not able to identify who did that to him, and that is one thing that I hope this Bill will cover. I hope that it will not cover things such as my dad accidentally locking a cat in the fridge—we did manage to get the cat out once we found where the miaowing was coming from.
I welcome the Bill. One of the main issues in my inbox is pet theft and animal cruelty. am so glad that the Government are acting on it, because it is a huge concern for the people of Hyndburn and Haslingden. I wholeheartedly welcome this extra step to protect our animals—our loved ones.
It is a pleasure to follow my hon. Friend the Member for Hyndburn (Sara Britcliffe) and also to finally get to speak on a Friday, Mr Deputy Speaker. It has been far too long, for various covid-related reasons, and although I put in for the two earlier debates, they were clearly oversubscribed. These Fridays are such a crucial part of our constitution and the Standing Orders of this House. Our debates today—the debates on the menopause and childcare and now this important debate—show the House at its best. I am really pleased to finally be able to participate on a private Members’ Friday.
It is also a huge pleasure to speak in favour of this Bill, introduced by my hon. Friend the Member for Romford (Andrew Rosindell), who, Members might not know, was my MP two decades ago. When I graduated from university, I moved to Romford to live with friends there for a while, shortly after the 2001 general election. I see that a lot of the 2019 intake are here today. We should remember that this man was the first step on our road back to a majority and back into government, because he gained that seat in 2001, and he did it by campaigning with a Staffordshire bull terrier called Spike, round the streets of Romford in a Union Jack waistcoat.
I pay tribute to my hon. Friend for that and for all that he has done in his career in this place to make animal welfare such a focus. We heard from my hon. Friend the Member for Rushcliffe (Ruth Edwards) about his work in opposition as spokesman, we have this Bill today and he is bringing forward Jasmine’s law to increase tenants’ rights to keep pets in their homes. He has done so much work, including through his role in the APPG.
I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Romford, too, on what he did yesterday. We saw the beautiful pictures of him and my right hon. Friend the Member for Rayleigh and Wickford (Mr Francois) with Vivienne winning the Westminster dog of the year award, in memory of Sir David Amess. We all feel Sir David’s loss very keenly today, because we know that he would be here, making a speech as funny as, if not funnier than, some of the ones we have heard on these Benches, because he was such an advocate for animal welfare and such a keen advocate of private Members’ Fridays.
1:14 pm
Ben Everitt (Milton Keynes North) (Con)
I rise to support this commendable Bill, which has come at a fantastic time. In particular, I am very proud to be a Government Member under what I think is the most animal-friendly Government in the history of this country. I am also surrounded by, it appears to me, the most animal-friendly members of that Government, including my hon. Friend the Member for Rushcliffe (Ruth Edwards), whose adventures in animal husbandry seem to have put her in good stead for her current job. Being a PPS is probably incredibly similar to her adventures with Andrew.
I am pleased that farmers will not be unfairly penalised and that the risk of unfairly penalising them will be reduced as a result of these measures. Putting the penalty midway between a caution and the full force of the law seems to be a sensible step to make sure that the mid-range is available to prosecutors. Farmers are possibly the biggest friends that animals have, because it is literally their job to be kind to animals. If they are not, they are doing their job badly. I am not saying that there are not rare cases of that not happening, but in general, I take my hat off to our farmers, particularly those in Milton Keynes North.
I met the fantastic people from Milton Keynes & District Cats Protection recently. We got our cats from there. My hon. Friend the Member for Bishop Auckland (Dehenna Davison) gave an impromptu shout out to my youngest—my anarchist—so it would be remiss of me not to mention my two cats, Magic and Ninja. We have enjoyed them as lockdown cats over the last year.
Their names are a tribute to my campaigning prowess because I lobbied hard for them to be called Slash and Axl. Unfortunately, I was outnumbered in the household by just four to one. I note that the cats of my hon. Friend the Member for Hyndburn (Sara Britcliffe) came from Cats Protection as well. It was sad to hear that Noodle was shot with a BB gun as a kitten and, frankly, well done to Noodle for making it to 21 years.
Cats Protection wanted to talk to me about the huge increase in airgun attacks on cats in the last few years. It is right to draw awareness to animal welfare and animal cruelty issues, so I commend my hon. Friend the Member for Romford (Andrew Rosindell) for bringing the Bill to the House.
Having mentioned Noodle, I cannot miss the opportunity to mention Peter Britcliffe, who apparently put the cat in the fridge. As the former Mayor of Hyndburn, we always knew that he was a cool cat but apparently that is his hobby as well.
Milton Keynes is a wonderful place but, unfortunately, it struggles with some animal welfare issues, not just the unfortunate airgun incidents that have occurred in the last year. There is also an increasing risk of pet theft, so I am pleased about these measures, which would be a timely addition to our armoury in prosecutions and sentencing.
It is a pleasure to follow the very powerful and amusing speech by my hon. Friend the Member for Milton Keynes North (Ben Everitt). I will not be able to do anything near as good in the brief moments I will speak for in this debate.
I just want to start by paying tribute to my hon. Friend the Member for Romford (Andrew Rosindell) for bringing forward the Bill, which is very important. We are a nation of animal lovers. Those are not just words. We are not just talking the talk; we are walking the walk in terms of the legislation we have been bringing forward on animal welfare protections. The Bill forms a part of a whole suite of measures that we have been bringing in. I am also an animal lover. We have two cats at home, Ragnar and Frazzle, both of whom are rescue cats. I suspect that if Frazzle is watching today—I would be amazed if he is—he might have some concerns about the measures being proposed, because he is certainly not an animal lover when it comes to the amount of mice he brings home on a regular basis, so I hope there will be exclusions for cat violence in the legislation.
It is completely right that we have a range of approaches to enforcement and not the very binary approach pointed out by my hon. Friend the Member for Romford. A variety of different measures will help people to do the right thing and support for improved animal welfare will be absolutely superb.
I just want to finish by doing a big shout out to two organisations I have a huge amount of time for. First, the work of Cats Protection in supporting cats and re-homing rescue cats is absolutely brilliant. Secondly, Battersea Dogs and Cats Home, rather confusingly given the name, also has a site in my constituency. I thank it for its work on supporting the welfare of animals.
I congratulate the hon. Member for Romford (Andrew Rosindell) on bringing forward the Bill. His passion for animal welfare is well known and admired across the House. I also associate myself with all the comments about Sir David Amess. It is absolutely right that he would have been here contributing today. We are so sorry not to have him here with us.
This is very clearly a Government Bill—it was referenced in the Government’s action plan for animal welfare—so I will treat it as such. Some of my comments will be directed as much at the Minister and the Department as at the hon. Member for Romford.
To some extent, this is a puzzling Bill. It is really about penalty notices as much as it is about animals. To see that, one just has to read the long title of the Bill, which is to
“Make provision for and in connection with the giving of penalty notices for certain offences relating to animals and animal products.”
That says to me—I am not a lawyer, but it says it to my legal friends with whom I am consulting—that this is as much about the legal system as it is about animals. I disagree with some of the comments by Government Members. I do not think it is particularly well-drafted. When I first read the Bill my worry was that there was a danger that some of the offences in Labour’s groundbreaking Animal Welfare Act 2006—Labour Members are very, very proud of the 2006 Act—were at risk of being downgraded to the level of a parking ticket.
I listened very closely to the hon. Member for Romford’s speech and I am reassured. I see what he is trying to do. I have also spoken to the Minister and she has reassured me that that is not the aim of the exercise. I welcome the Under-Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, the hon. Member for Bury St Edmunds (Jo Churchill) to her place. As I said to her colleague the other day, the shadow Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs team is flattered that the Government have felt the need to bring in reinforcements. I wish her well in her role, which is a fantastic job to be doing. I believe her reassurance, which is why we will not be opposing the Bill. I know how Fridays work. It has happened to me before. We know how to do it, but we are not going to.
I am proud to support this Bill, as everybody has said today. I pay tribute to every comment about who is not here but should be.
To lighten the mood somewhat, I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Romford (Andrew Rosindell). He is a champion for all animal rights issues. I have not been home for two weeks, because last weekend my family came to London and I was checking out his wonderful work as chair of the all-party parliamentary group on zoos and aquariums with a visit to London zoo. He is right about the magnificent work and conservation that our zoos do in this country. I commend my hon. Friend on his handling of Vivienne, but he also had quite a job handling my right hon. Friend the Member for Rayleigh and Wickford (Mr Francois). [Laughter.] He took his time.
It is fitting that we are talking about this Bill in the same week as the Second Reading of the Animal Welfare (Kept Animals) Bill. As we have been mentioning people’s pets, I cannot fail to highlight my pets briefly. There are my two children’s rescue guinea pigs. If Members are given the option of rescuing guinea pigs, do take it. The only use they serve is keeping the grass very short. The other pet is a rescue cat clearly named after the greatest guitarist of all time, Clapton. His rescue name was Eric.
I am delighted to reinforce our position that we are a global champion for animal rights. As my hon. Friend the Member for Milton Keynes North (Ben Everitt) said, it is worrying that so many complaints are made about cruelty to animals. In particular, there is the statistic that every 30 seconds, someone raises a call to the RSPCA in England and Wales. I hope the Bill of my hon. Friend the Member for Romford will start to address that. It is a bridging Bill, so it will do that. It is between where custodial sentences are not sufficient and crimes at the other end of the scale where the Bill will begin to take effect.
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Unfortunately, however, some farmers continually fail to record accurately, which causes serious risk. This is where I would like to see penalty notices applied in a fair, transparent and proportionate way to positively change behaviours. That would help us to ultimately protect public health, animal welfare and the national herds and flocks. Yet, as I mentioned, the enforcement tools available to deal with such matters are either quite gentle or quite severe. On the quite gentle end of the spectrum, we have advice and guidance, and then, for the most severe offences, we have the option of pursuing imprisonment with unlimited fines. Until now, the cross-compliance scheme has been one of the major means of ensuring that animal health and welfare standards have been met by eligible animal keepers.
Many colleagues will be aware that cross-compliance and the way that it applies subsidy deductions is widely viewed as disproportionate and unfair, particularly by our farming communities. A system of penalty notices, which are financial penalties of up to £5,000, would be fairer and more effective than the EU’s disproportionate and convoluted cross-compliance, and that would extend beyond farm animals into companion animals, zoo animals and animal products.
These proposals would give individuals an opportunity to pay a penalty for any type of transgression, similar to a speeding ticket, as an alternative to a potential court case. We can all agree that, in the most severe cases, this will never be appropriate for those who abuse animals in the worst ways. It does not water down our ability to punish those who abuse animals; it simply provides something in between to deal with less serious transgressions. It will always be appropriate to take criminal prosecution against those who cause and commit the worst crimes against animals. However, where there is an opportunity for us to improve our ability to protect animals from mistreatment by supporting an individual to understand their responsibilities, we will be able to look to apply a penalty.
My Bill establishes powers that will enable us to determine which offences are appropriate through secondary legislation. Under the Bill, penalty notices are applicable for offences under Acts including—to name a few—the Animal Welfare Act 2006, the Animal Health Act 1981, relevant sections of the European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018, and the Dangerous Dogs Act 1991. I am delighted that by introducing the Bill we are extending much further than cross-compliance was able to achieve, and in a fairer and more transparent way. That will be an animal welfare gain.
With this Bill, we will continue to build our enforcement capabilities, which will further demonstrate our standards in England as world leading. This is a simple measure with a big impact to make sure that we respond proportionately to each transgression, which could include scenarios where pet breeders fail to include their licence numbers on online adverts for puppies and kittens. Businesses that breed animals must have a valid licence: accidentally missing the licence number from an advert or forgetting to microchip the animals before rehoming them can seem inconsequential, but proper registration is critical in ensuring that people can buy pets with confidence from a legitimate source with the high health and welfare standards that they rightly expect. A financial penalty would be a proportionate response to highlight that these actions are not inconsequential, and would have a real impact on the people who rehome the animals.
The UK zoo sector has among the highest welfare standards in the world, as well as being among the world leaders in conservation work. On behalf of all of us, I thank the British and Irish Association of Zoos and Aquariums for the magnificent work it does all year round in promoting the values of good zoos and aquariums, and for the support it offers to me as chairman of the all-party parliamentary group on zoos and aquariums.
Sadly, however, a small number of zoos do not always live up to our high expectations. When local authorities find an issue, they can put a condition in place. If that condition is not met, a direction may be applied. In many cases, a zoo will respond well to the initial condition and it will improve its behaviour. For those that do not, the local authority may decide to issue a penalty notice, particularly if the condition does not directly link to the care of the animals. I would welcome the addition of penalty notices in this area to provide an additional enforcement tool alongside issuing a direction, to highlight the importance of acting in line with a set condition.
This is a simple Bill consisting of nine clauses. It initially lays out the powers that enforcement authorities will have to issue penalties under the relevant Act, as listed in the Bill. It states that the police will be responsible for applying penalty notices for offences relating to dangerous dogs committed in England and Wales. It explains that penalty notices give a person the opportunity to discharge their liability for the offence, and states that enforcement authorities will have six months to take the case to court if the penalty is not paid after 28 days. It also confirms the maximum penalty of £5,000 —or £2,500 if the penalty is paid within 14 days.
The Bill contains multiple safeguards to ensure that penalties are applied fairly. These include specified factors that enforcement authorities must take into account when considering whether a penalty is appropriate, to ensure that we take a tailored yet consistent approach. There will be official guidance laid before Parliament, which enforcement authorities will need to consider before issuing a penalty. It will be important for the Government to work closely with those that keep animals to ensure that the guidance effectively sets out how penalty notices should be applied.
This Bill sets out the enabling powers to introduce offences through statutory instruments. The majority of the Bill will come into force two months after Royal Assent, with the rest coming into force when relevant secondary legislation is in place. I want to give particular thanks to the organisations from the farming community that have engaged with me on the Bill, including the National Farmers Union, the Livestock Auctioneers’ Association Ltd, the National Pig Association and the Country Land and Business Association. I understand the difficulties that they faced in dealing with the interaction between animal welfare and the common agricultural policy. I am glad that, now we have left the constraints of the European Union, the farming community have shown their support for the fair and proportional penalty notice system in my Bill.
We are very fortunate to have so many organisations dedicated to carrying out important work for animals: Dogs Trust, Battersea, the Royal Society for the Protection of Animals and the Kennel Club, among many others that do so much for the welfare of pets across our country.
When, as I hope, the Bill is enacted, we will have secured a much-needed framework for a proportionate financial penalty system. Our Government have responded to the people’s will and led the country out of the clutches of the European Union, and that has given us an opportunity—which we must not waste—to improve our standards in many areas, with animal welfare at the very top of our agenda. Today we are continuing to elevate our world-leading reputation for animal health and welfare. The Bill marks an important step in establishing new enforcement in England to ensure that we have an appropriate response to transgressions, so that we can prevent individuals from ever reaching a stage at which severe punishment is required. Today marks the start of the journey of penalty notices to further protect the animals that we are so privileged to have within our care. I thank all Members, on both sides of the House, for giving it their support today.
However, the penalties in this Bill are not for errant animals; they are for humans who are not treating their animals properly. I am really proud of the work that the Government are doing to protect animal welfare. We have the Animal Welfare (Sentencing) Act 2021, which received Royal Assent earlier this year and raised the maximum prison sentence from six months to five years. We have the new offence for pet abduction, again championed by Members on all sides of the House. The Animal Welfare (Kept Animals) Bill, which had its Second Reading earlier this week, tackles puppy smuggling, the export of live animals for slaughter, and livestock worrying. It expands the definition of animals to include alpacas—our alpacas will be very pleased to hear about that—and includes a ban on keeping primates as pets.
My hon. Friend’s Bill fills an important gap here, toughening sentences for offences that do not qualify for criminal prosecution but that are too serious to receive a warning. I was shocked to hear that the RSPCA received 57,000 complaints of animal cruelty last year. It is so important that we have tougher penalties to tackle that kind of behaviour at a very early stage and, hopefully, to act as an educational tool and to prevent things from getting much worse.
I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Romford again. I am pleased to be supporting this Bill and proud that the Government are, too. As I have said before, pets in our house are people, not property. They are our friends, our companions and they deserve nothing less.
This Bill, as others have said, follows the Government’s already landmark legislation on animal welfare sentencing, which increased penalties from six months to five years. As my hon. Friend said in his opening remarks, the Bill will allow us to match judicial powers more appropriately to the sort of offences we see. We already have the possibility of jail for the most serious offences and we already have situations where it is clearly far more appropriate for people to be given warnings, but there is a lacuna in the middle. This Bill, which has been carefully drafted, addresses that in exactly the right way. It will prevent more cruel mistreatment of pets, zoo animals and livestock.
I know that the Bill has been welcomed by the Government and so many animal charities, and I assume by the Opposition, although we have not heard from them yet. I would gently say that when we have such wide cross-party support for a Bill, it is incumbent on us all as Back Benchers to scrutinise the detail, and I have done that. I have looked at the clauses, and they seem very well drafted to me, so I congratulate my hon. Friend—and, I am sure, the Clerks as well—on that.
However, I am also conscious that we should continue to scrutinise the effects of Bills after they become Acts. As a data maven myself, I therefore particularly welcome clause 6, on reporting. We will very quickly be able see the effects of the Bill through the reports that it requires the Secretary of State to make. I am sure we will do that in the years ahead and hopefully see that it is having the positive effect that I know we all want it to.
As my hon. Friend said, this Bill is fair, transparent and proportionate. Those are the qualities that we want to see in private Members’ legislation. I very much hope that it gets its Second Reading today, and that it goes through Committee and we see it back in this Chamber for Third Reading. By widening the suite of available enforcement tools, it will truly safeguard and strengthen animal health and welfare across the country, which is something that I believe all of us across the House can welcome.
This week, we launched the Milton Keynes pet theft taskforce. I am pleased to be working with Shazna Muzammil, Police and Crime Commissioner Matthew Barber, my neighbour and hon. Friend the Member for Milton Keynes South (Iain Stewart), and Councillor Alex Walker, who is the leader of the Milton Keynes Conservative group. Pet theft is an animal welfare issue, because people who steal pets will not necessarily be very nice to them, so that tool in our armoury for prosecutions is welcome.
I will end with some statistics. The 2020 RSPCA statistics mentioned by my hon. Friend the Member for Rushcliffe are more up to date than the ones I have, but were potentially affected by the pandemic. In 2019, the RSPCA investigated more than 130,000 complaints of cruelty against animals and secured 1,678 convictions. Any incidence of cruelty against animals is too much, therefore I will be supporting the Bill.
To be fair, this is not just about the hon. Member’s reassurances or the Minister’s reassurances. In their briefings, both the RSPCA and Battersea Dogs and Cats Home expressed support for the use of fixed-penalty notices to tackle low-level breaches of animal welfare law. That is the crunch of the question that I asked myself about the Bill: how we are sure that it is about low-level breaches.
I am not sure the Government entirely helped themselves in the way the explanatory notes set out the context for the Bill. Anyone coming to them afresh would read through them and not be entirely sure, without the benefit of the hon. Member for Romford’s speech, that they had understood it. I would have thought the starting point would have been the action plan for animal welfare, which sets out the context. In fact, the explanatory notes immediately attack CAP cross-compliance. I just say to Conservative Members: get over it. Labour Members have gotten over it. We are looking ahead. We do not have to keep looking back and replaying the arguments of the past.
If Conservative Members are congratulating themselves on how animal friendly they are, I suggest they visit their local pig farms, if they have them in their part of the country. I went a few weeks ago, and what I saw was very sad. They are overstocked, and the tail biting and aggressive behaviour, and so on, is awful for the animals—it is also pretty awful for the people working with them. I ask hon. Members to reflect, as that is perhaps one of the unforeseen consequences of recent changes. We have to find a solution, because there is nothing animal friendly about 6,000 pigs being culled on farms, with possibly more to come.
There is an attempt to link the Bill with CAP cross-compliance, which we all know has had problems—no one is saying it was a particularly successful system, although these things are not as easy as they might look. We might reflect on that. The way the Bill is framed, those cross-compliance issues have to be related to animals. Having read the explanatory notes, that is not entirely clear.
These are the kinds of things we will be exploring in Committee, because there is a concern about the lack of clarity. The positive spin is that this Bill is an extra tool in the toolbox to aid compliance, which is absolutely fine. If the Bill were to replace the penalties for quite serious offences with the equivalent of a parking ticket, that is not fine. Leaving the choice on where that line is drawn to officials and Ministers through obscure secondary legislation is also not fine.
Although animal welfare organisations support the Bill, their concerns can be discerned in some of the briefings. Battersea says the “beyond all reasonable doubt” criterion that an enforcement authority has to satisfy before issuing a fixed penalty notice could have unforeseen consequences for offences that currently require lower levels of proof. It rightly says that the guidance will be critical to ensuring that there is some uniformity of practice. I welcome the reporting proposals, but the reporting needs to be uniform so it is clear to enforcers when fixed penalty notices are the appropriate tool to use.
Similarly, the RSPCA says
“more discussion will be needed when secondary legislation is laid on which areas will be prioritised and what offences will be covered.”
In my view that is too late. There needs to be more clarity in the Bill, and the Minister has indicated that she appreciates that and that it will be considered in Committee. Indeed, she might wish to consider whether the entire system needs some oversight and whether there is a role for an animal welfare commissioner, as Labour has suggested.
It is perhaps worth asking some basic questions about why the current system does not work, or about the extent to which it does or does not work. Where is the empirical evidence? Has the research been done? If so, can we see it? How many prosecutions have been brought under the various legislation? How many were successful, and what was the effect? How much recidivism has there been?
A cynic might wonder whether this Bill should actually be called the “complete failure of the Tory criminal justice system, (attempt to clear the backlog)” Bill. Although some might see that as unfair, it is the Opposition’s job to ask questions, and we will. If we do not get the answers, we will draw our own conclusions.
We all want the legislation we pass in this place to work, and Sir David and I had exactly this discussion in the Chamber some months ago on his attempt to address the long-standing, vexed issue of tethered horses. He made the good point that if Acts of Parliament are not properly enforced, we find ourselves having the same debate 17 or 20 years later. It is crucial that we get it right.
I am happy to give the Minister the benefit of the doubt. I am not entirely convinced but, provided proper safeguards are introduced in Committee—I am sure I have her word on that—we can go forward together.
I have been asked to keep my speech short, but I mention that in North Norfolk, we are clearly an area of enormous animal lovers. You are somewhat in the minority if you are not found on the beach on a Sunday morning with a lead in hand walking the dog. For that reason, I welcome the pet theft taskforce launched in the summer. Many of us in rural constituencies have had huge numbers of animal thefts reported over the pandemic. The Home Office, the Ministry of Justice and the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs all coming together to try to tackle this issue is very welcome. Having constituents too scared to go out and walk their dog for fear of having it stolen is a sad reflection on society. I am very proud and thank my hon. Friend the Member for Romford enormously for the work he is doing to bridge the gap and penalise those who do such a dreadful thing in society as harming animals.